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<blockquote data-quote="MessengerofGod" data-source="post: 2232434" data-attributes="member: 715531">As you know, many (if not most) of the Popes of only a few centuries ago were super-evil and corrupt, pulling strings behind the scenes and swiftly disposing of anyone who challenged them.By contrast, The Pope today couldn&#039;t take over a Baskin-Robbins.I mean, seriously.LOOK at him.-_-As far as forgiving sins goes, however, that&#039;s another matter entirely:&quot;On the evening of that day, the first day of the week, the doors being locked where the disciples were for fear of the Jews, Jesus came and stood among them and said to them, “Peace be with you.” When he had said this, he showed them his hands and his side. Then the disciples were glad when they saw the Lord. Jesus said to them again, “Peace be with you. As the Father has sent me, even so I am sending you.” And when he had said this, he breathed on them and said to them, “Receive the Holy Spirit. If you forgive the sins of any, they are forgiven them; if you withhold forgiveness from any, it is withheld.”&quot; -- John 20:19-23 (ESV)The issue isn&#039;t so much that only God can forgive sins, because clearly Jesus is granting that right to His followers in the above passage. The issue is the way the Pope and Catholic priests in general act like such a thing applies only to them. It doesn&#039;t. Also, in Revelation 1:5-6 (ESV) we see &quot;To him who loves us and has freed us from our sins by his blood and made us a kingdom, priests to his God and Father, to him be glory and dominion forever and ever. Amen.&quot; And in 1 Peter 2:9 (ESV) it says &quot;But you are a chosen race, a royal priesthood, a holy nation, a people for his own possession, that you may proclaim the excellencies of him who called you out of darkness into his marvelous light.&quot; At first you might think they&#039;re only referring to Jew(ish Christian)s because of the use of words like &quot;race&quot; and &quot;nation&quot;. But check out Romans 11:17 (I&#039;ll use the NLT here &#039;cos it phrases it a bit better): &quot;But some of these branches from Abraham&#039;s tree--some of the people of Israel--have been broken off. And you Gentiles, who were branches from a wild olive tree, have been grafted in. So now you also receive the blessing God has promised Abraham and his children, sharing in the rich nourishment from the root of God&#039;s special olive tree.&quot; Now pay attention:If Paul says we get the blessing of Abraham &amp; co bestowed on us for being &quot;grafted in&quot; to the &quot;tree&quot;......and if Peter says that there&#039;s this &quot;royal priesthood&quot; and &quot;holy nation&quot; and stuff like that, and John (Revelation) uses similar phrases, then you look in the OT and you see it there too, such as Exodus 19:6......then that means all of us true believers are priests, not just some guy in a funny outfit or whatever. We are all priests and are allowed as close to God as the OT Temple priests were. The only difference is that for us it&#039;s more of a subtle, intimate, emotional connection as opposed to just serving Him because He&#039;s filling the room with His presence and you don&#039;t wanna get zapped.There may be pastors to help do the &quot;shepherding&quot;, ministers to preach and teach the less informed, and so on, but there are to be no more so-called &quot;priests&quot; &#039;cause we are all priests now and Jesus is our High Priest.So umm...with all due respect the Pope&#039;s probably a nice bloke to have a beer and hang out flying a kite with or whatever but he&#039;s got no more genuine spiritual authority than me or any other random Christian. Not even if that stuff Catholics say about Peter and the whole &quot;on this rock I will build my church&quot; bit is true -- which it probably isn&#039;t (they probably twist it because they don&#039;t know any better).....Incidentally the Roman Catholic Church is the church of Rome, obviously, but when you think about it that&#039;s a bit sad &#039;cos Paul wrote a letter to the church there when it was in its infancy (the book of &quot;Romans&quot; -- go figure) back before they became totally rubbish and got taken over by weirdos. If he ever found out what they&#039;ve become he&#039;d turn in his grave.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="MessengerofGod, post: 2232434, member: 715531"] As you know, many (if not most) of the Popes of only a few centuries ago were super-evil and corrupt, pulling strings behind the scenes and swiftly disposing of anyone who challenged them. By contrast, The Pope today couldn't take over a Baskin-Robbins. I mean, seriously. LOOK at him. -_- As far as forgiving sins goes, however, that's another matter entirely: "On the evening of that day, the first day of the week, the doors being locked where the disciples were for fear of the Jews, Jesus came and stood among them and said to them, “Peace be with you.” When he had said this, he showed them his hands and his side. Then the disciples were glad when they saw the Lord. Jesus said to them again, “Peace be with you. As the Father has sent me, even so I am sending you.” And when he had said this, he breathed on them and said to them, “Receive the Holy Spirit. If you forgive the sins of any, they are forgiven them; if you withhold forgiveness from any, it is withheld.”" -- John 20:19-23 (ESV) The issue isn't so much that only God can forgive sins, because clearly Jesus is granting that right to His followers in the above passage. The issue is the way the Pope and Catholic priests in general act like such a thing applies only to them. It doesn't. Also, in Revelation 1:5-6 (ESV) we see "To him who loves us and has freed us from our sins by his blood and made us a kingdom, priests to his God and Father, to him be glory and dominion forever and ever. Amen." And in 1 Peter 2:9 (ESV) it says "But you are a chosen race, a royal priesthood, a holy nation, a people for his own possession, that you may proclaim the excellencies of him who called you out of darkness into his marvelous light." At first you might think they're only referring to Jew(ish Christian)s because of the use of words like "race" and "nation". But check out Romans 11:17 (I'll use the NLT here 'cos it phrases it a bit better): "But some of these branches from Abraham's tree--some of the people of Israel--have been broken off. And you Gentiles, who were branches from a wild olive tree, have been grafted in. So now you also receive the blessing God has promised Abraham and his children, sharing in the rich nourishment from the root of God's special olive tree." Now pay attention: If Paul says we get the blessing of Abraham & co bestowed on us for being "grafted in" to the "tree"... ...and if Peter says that there's this "royal priesthood" and "holy nation" and stuff like that, and John (Revelation) uses similar phrases, then you look in the OT and you see it there too, such as Exodus 19:6... ...then that means all of us true believers are priests, not just some guy in a funny outfit or whatever. We are all priests and are allowed as close to God as the OT Temple priests were. The only difference is that for us it's more of a subtle, intimate, emotional connection as opposed to just serving Him because He's filling the room with His presence and you don't wanna get zapped. There may be pastors to help do the "shepherding", ministers to preach and teach the less informed, and so on, but there are to be no more so-called "priests" 'cause we are all priests now and Jesus is our High Priest. So umm...with all due respect the Pope's probably a nice bloke to have a beer and hang out flying a kite with or whatever but he's got no more genuine spiritual authority than me or any other random Christian. Not even if that stuff Catholics say about Peter and the whole "on this rock I will build my church" bit is true -- which it probably isn't (they probably twist it because they don't know any better)..... Incidentally the Roman Catholic Church is the church of Rome, obviously, but when you think about it that's a bit sad 'cos Paul wrote a letter to the church there when it was in its infancy (the book of "Romans" -- go figure) back before they became totally rubbish and got taken over by weirdos. If he ever found out what they've become he'd turn in his grave. [/QUOTE]

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