Sure I don't think it's quite as simple as black/white. There are going to be issues that you find disagreeable to your standards having been raised in the western world. No doubt. But again... when one starts talking about this culture or that culture being superior to another then the first thing I question is what is their definition of culture. I tend to find they usually hold a notion of culture that is quaint at best flat out ignorant at worst.
Are we spoiled?
- Thread starter johnny13334
- Start date
The Iranians i know really dislike arabs. Iraqis in particular. I got my infromation first hand.
The reason i think western europeans looked down on easterners is because there is more poverty in eastern europe. Also as recently as WW2 eastern europe was still in the age of serfs and feudal lords. Perhaps that is why the Nazis saw them as racial inferirors. Ill have to do some more research to find out for sure.
The reason i think western europeans looked down on easterners is because there is more poverty in eastern europe. Also as recently as WW2 eastern europe was still in the age of serfs and feudal lords. Perhaps that is why the Nazis saw them as racial inferirors. Ill have to do some more research to find out for sure.
onederful2nite
Member
- Mar 30, 2008
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You haven't really answered any of the questions I've put to you... but what really gets me is you're on about cultural superiority yet you don't have a grasp of the history or the people you're referring to.
It doesn't make for much of a conversation.
It doesn't make for much of a conversation.
Culture seemed more relevant maybe 200 years ago. but with globalisation its fading however.
however ive heard many people in the UK diss the cultural practices of other countries which have no negative consequences such as eating duck egg fetuses (fetusi? sp.?) in vietnam.
its purely down to ignorance and unwillingness to experience things outside their own sphere.
EDIT:
i diss TCM all the time, but it has little to do with racism and more about the environment and science. but its a cultural practice.
however ive heard many people in the UK diss the cultural practices of other countries which have no negative consequences such as eating duck egg fetuses (fetusi? sp.?) in vietnam.
its purely down to ignorance and unwillingness to experience things outside their own sphere.
EDIT:
i diss TCM all the time, but it has little to do with racism and more about the environment and science. but its a cultural practice.
Ok here we go again... what is your definition of culture? By my definition of it...
what you have just said makes no sense. People haven't stopped dealing with the world around them through the methods they've learned over generations or habits/traits and tools that have been passed on by their parent/family/peoples. So how on earth can 'culture' be irrelevant.
The definition of culture being used is at the very crux of this conversation...
Better known as xenophibia gastronomique.
what you have just said makes no sense. People haven't stopped dealing with the world around them through the methods they've learned over generations or habits/traits and tools that have been passed on by their parent/family/peoples. So how on earth can 'culture' be irrelevant.
The definition of culture being used is at the very crux of this conversation...
Better known as xenophibia gastronomique.
globalisation is slowly creating a global culture. its slowly modifying old cultures and creating new ones.
Pinoyland is a great example.
is language not a part of culture?
any one who uses the internet (arguably the greatest part of globalisation) knows "LOL"
if they dont know what it means by words, they understand its significance.
food is a part of culture through customs right?
i know very few places in the world in which a macdonalds doesnt exist.
globalisation ftw
Pinoyland is a great example.
is language not a part of culture?
any one who uses the internet (arguably the greatest part of globalisation) knows "LOL"
if they dont know what it means by words, they understand its significance.
food is a part of culture through customs right?
i know very few places in the world in which a macdonalds doesnt exist.
globalisation ftw
Some_Guy_in_Ithaca_NY
New member
- Feb 28, 2008
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Umm... that sort of attitude is really rather disingenuous don't you think. I've asked you several questions that you just flat out haven't bothered to answer (go back and read my posts again - the questions are still there). If you don't have an answer or don't want to answer then just say so. But to cop an attitude that you've posted something soooooo beyond the powers of comprehension really makes you appear silly.
Oh the irony.
You were just on about comprehension no? So care to explain how your definition of 'culture' can be so flatly polarized and put onto a scale of good or bad.
Direct question coming up:
Do you really honestly not hold all cultures to be equally legitimate expressions of human existence, therefore best viewd from a purely neutral perspective?
Again if you don't have an answer or don't want to post one then by all means don't but please don't insult the intelligence of myself or the people at MAP bothering to read this thread by pulling the whole 'your reading comprehension is soooo bad' schtick. It's a cop out.
Oh the irony.
You were just on about comprehension no? So care to explain how your definition of 'culture' can be so flatly polarized and put onto a scale of good or bad.
Direct question coming up:
Do you really honestly not hold all cultures to be equally legitimate expressions of human existence, therefore best viewd from a purely neutral perspective?
Again if you don't have an answer or don't want to post one then by all means don't but please don't insult the intelligence of myself or the people at MAP bothering to read this thread by pulling the whole 'your reading comprehension is soooo bad' schtick. It's a cop out.
What you are describing a phenomena that is related to culture... in and of itself it's an element of culture or the globalization of certain habits... but it doesn't somehow by it's existence automatically make culture less relevant. Because people say people use net speak when they're online somehow it's made their ability to deal with the world around them less... err... relevant. What you said still makes no sense... and what you just posted doesn't in any way support your assertion that 'culture' is less relevant now than it was 200 years ago. I really would have to ask if they let you get away with this line of reasoning where you go to school?
Which is again why I'm asking you what both you and Vampyregirl don't seem to have an answer for...
What is your definition of 'culture'?
Can you agree or disagree with the definition of 'culture' that I've posted?
Which is again why I'm asking you what both you and Vampyregirl don't seem to have an answer for...
What is your definition of 'culture'?
Can you agree or disagree with the definition of 'culture' that I've posted?
If all cultures equally legitimate expressions of human existance why do you not see westerners immigrating to the third world but you sure people from the third world coming here. I think all of them want to come over.
Do you really consider a primitive culture with barbaric practices to be equally expressive of humanity as a modern western culture?
Do you really consider a primitive culture with barbaric practices to be equally expressive of humanity as a modern western culture?
oh!
i totally agree with your definition but it needs a few additions like language!
globalisation makes visible differences in culture less prominent and the ability to accept them much easier and therefore blurs our understanding of different cultures.
its existence makes it less of an issue that separates groups and people of different backgrounds as it creates a global culture that is largely shared.
why are you prodding this? is there a follow up question? im curious
i totally agree with your definition but it needs a few additions like language!
globalisation makes visible differences in culture less prominent and the ability to accept them much easier and therefore blurs our understanding of different cultures.
its existence makes it less of an issue that separates groups and people of different backgrounds as it creates a global culture that is largely shared.
why are you prodding this? is there a follow up question? im curious
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH
I got it out of my system.
many westerners move to "lesser developed countries"
"primitive culture with barbaric practices" in your eyes because of your conditioning, they are barbaric and primitive.
i think wiping your bum with toilet paper is barbaric when washing is clearly more hygenic and less chaffing - thats cos of my conditioning.
I got it out of my system.
many westerners move to "lesser developed countries"
"primitive culture with barbaric practices" in your eyes because of your conditioning, they are barbaric and primitive.
i think wiping your bum with toilet paper is barbaric when washing is clearly more hygenic and less chaffing - thats cos of my conditioning.
There we go again. Cultural relativism rears its ulgy head.
The prime one that disproves cultural relativism for me is female genital mutilation.
I don't think it's barbaric and primitive because of my conditioning or because it's from a different culture or because I think western culture is superior. I think it's barbaric and primitive because it IS barbaric and primitive.
The prime one that disproves cultural relativism for me is female genital mutilation.
I don't think it's barbaric and primitive because of my conditioning or because it's from a different culture or because I think western culture is superior. I think it's barbaric and primitive because it IS barbaric and primitive.
DeathMasked
Member
- Mar 9, 2008
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ughh.... where to start... ok here goes
Right. Because their culture is inferior they decide to emigrate to another country right? And that is a bad thing right? I mean what were those crazy Irish thinking by moving to America? Or how in the hell did we tolerate the Polish, the Dutch, the Germans, the Swedes or just about anyone else moving in the Americas? I mean really... they immigrated... so obviously they must have had an inferior culture right? By your logic no one but the Native Americans should be in America right? I mean the Europeans had it so sussed and their "culture" according to you was so superior one wonders why they ever left the Garden of Eden that was Europe. I'd imagine you'd be jumping right in there and lynching black people but I guess we can't blame them as they were imported at the behest of your oh-so-innately superior culture right?
You don't think that socio-economic factors have the slightest thing to do with why people immigrate to other countries? Do you really believe that people have immigrated to the UK because they realize that their culture just isn't capable of a good fry up... or to the US because what the hell... they're so inferior they can't manage apple pie a la mode... and I'll be damned if those pesky inferiors of wherever are going to stay in their country when they can immigrate to Australia and get proper shrimp on the barby right?
1) define primitive
2) show that this 'primitive' trait you're referring to is the main cultural expression of a given culture (feel free to use actual examples)
3) You realize I could cut and paste what you just wrote and it would easily be something that was written about black people the KKK or about the Jews by Hitler or about most people by Stalin... great company you keep with that incredibly warped logic.
more direct questions:
Out of curiosity where did your people emigrate from?
Surely with your air superiority you must be living in the motherland or fatherland right? Surely you are now typing from smack dab in the heartland of western Europe no?
Right. Because their culture is inferior they decide to emigrate to another country right? And that is a bad thing right? I mean what were those crazy Irish thinking by moving to America? Or how in the hell did we tolerate the Polish, the Dutch, the Germans, the Swedes or just about anyone else moving in the Americas? I mean really... they immigrated... so obviously they must have had an inferior culture right? By your logic no one but the Native Americans should be in America right? I mean the Europeans had it so sussed and their "culture" according to you was so superior one wonders why they ever left the Garden of Eden that was Europe. I'd imagine you'd be jumping right in there and lynching black people but I guess we can't blame them as they were imported at the behest of your oh-so-innately superior culture right?
You don't think that socio-economic factors have the slightest thing to do with why people immigrate to other countries? Do you really believe that people have immigrated to the UK because they realize that their culture just isn't capable of a good fry up... or to the US because what the hell... they're so inferior they can't manage apple pie a la mode... and I'll be damned if those pesky inferiors of wherever are going to stay in their country when they can immigrate to Australia and get proper shrimp on the barby right?
1) define primitive
2) show that this 'primitive' trait you're referring to is the main cultural expression of a given culture (feel free to use actual examples)
3) You realize I could cut and paste what you just wrote and it would easily be something that was written about black people the KKK or about the Jews by Hitler or about most people by Stalin... great company you keep with that incredibly warped logic.
more direct questions:
Out of curiosity where did your people emigrate from?
Surely with your air superiority you must be living in the motherland or fatherland right? Surely you are now typing from smack dab in the heartland of western Europe no?
It's easy to grandstand your case when you choose the most extreme example. But the reality is that is not set in stone and it's under change... how much have you followed the subject recently? You do realize that not everyone subscribes to that custom right? You do realize that culture is to a certain extent dynamic and fluid right?
I actually agree that the given example is rather barbaric... it does violate certain rights that should be universal to humans. That however doesn't mean that by taking an extreme example of a cultural extant and showcasing it that a culture is somehow 'inferior'.
So now again back to definitions... what would your definition of culture be?
I actually agree that the given example is rather barbaric... it does violate certain rights that should be universal to humans. That however doesn't mean that by taking an extreme example of a cultural extant and showcasing it that a culture is somehow 'inferior'.
So now again back to definitions... what would your definition of culture be?
those are a few things in a culture thats much wider.
what about the barbaric and primitive practices of the US pig farming system. pig farming in Tanna is clearly much better despite what seems to be a primitive tribal community compared to the big avanced ole USA.
as you said, its all relative.
but vapyregirl made a horrible mass generalisation about the west compared to everywhere else. thats what i disagree with.
in no way is the west better, theyre different and have their own problems.
You mean africa right? where we all migrated from?
what about the barbaric and primitive practices of the US pig farming system. pig farming in Tanna is clearly much better despite what seems to be a primitive tribal community compared to the big avanced ole USA.
as you said, its all relative.
but vapyregirl made a horrible mass generalisation about the west compared to everywhere else. thats what i disagree with.
in no way is the west better, theyre different and have their own problems.
You mean africa right? where we all migrated from?
First of all you either are deliberatly trying to be provacative or you have totally missed the boat here.
Examples of primitive culture well lets see theres female genital mutilation, child marriage, honor killings, i could go on and on.
My ancestors came from Ireland originally. Did i not already post that? Canada is a european based society yes. the modern society we have now do you really think the native indians would have done it on their own?
Many europeans came here because its a huge country and at that time was full of cheap land. Many came here to realize their dream of being landownders.
You seem to think i hate immigrants. I already posted on the immigration debate and as i said i have friends who are immirants. Go back and read my thread on immigration if you want. Im not going to post it again.
Examples of primitive culture well lets see theres female genital mutilation, child marriage, honor killings, i could go on and on.
My ancestors came from Ireland originally. Did i not already post that? Canada is a european based society yes. the modern society we have now do you really think the native indians would have done it on their own?
Many europeans came here because its a huge country and at that time was full of cheap land. Many came here to realize their dream of being landownders.
You seem to think i hate immigrants. I already posted on the immigration debate and as i said i have friends who are immirants. Go back and read my thread on immigration if you want. Im not going to post it again.
bobsemyeunclee
New member
- Apr 13, 2008
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if did natives couldnt have created modern society, it doesnt matter. modern society isnt the gold standard and we shouldnt compare them.
native society was fine for the natives they didnt need to build anything differently or "greater".
heck i doubt theyd want to at the time
by using modern western society as a gold standard, you fail to accept other cultures.
native society was fine for the natives they didnt need to build anything differently or "greater".
heck i doubt theyd want to at the time
by using modern western society as a gold standard, you fail to accept other cultures.
StrictlySpeaking
New member
- Mar 24, 2008
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Still trying the whole attitude thing on for size eh? Sigh. Still not really working for you though.
I'm not trying to be provocative. I'm simply asking you direct questions based on what you post. You are the one that asserted that European culture is 'superior' to other cultures.
Sadly you don't have a very well thought definition of culture. You don't seem to really have thought much past the one line answer you provided. This is the root of the issue and probably much of the reason why your logic is so incredibly warped on this particular subject.
Umm... so Europe never had any of those problems right? Child marriage? Sweet Jesus... Europe wouldn't have had half the dynasties or royal lineages it had throughout it's history had it not been for child brides. Is your coofftopicnd of the history of your beloved "superior culture" so poor that you really can't see that? Honor killings? You don't think Europe has had equally barbaric practices? I think you need to post online less and bone up on your history. You could go on and on but my guess is that it'd be equally as easy to pick apart whatever argument you came up with as you try to shore up your dreams of superiority. Guess you've never heard of The House of Habsburg or the Habsburg Lip/Jaw... my God that type of thin only happens in the castes of dirty savages and their inferior cultures... ughh... has someone counted the silverware recently!?
Ah so you some from an immigrant family yourself. So wait a minute... if you culture is so superior then why did you have to move from Ireland? Surely your superior culture would have provided you with all the means to live a satisfying and fruitful life right without having to go take land from those savages with their inferior culture and barbaric practices right?
Yeah those savages and their barbaric practices would have never amounted to anything so you and your lot with superior culture are the natural and rightful people to control and run the show right? You're as racist as you are ignorant.
Well wait a minute... what happend to your fairytale land of cultural superiority. Surely with that abundance of superiority something should have been figured out without your lot having to move away.
Your posts in this thread alone pretty much show your attitudes toward immigrants or anyone who's not Western European. The irony is you yourself are an immigrant but you try to justify it every which way but loose. I'm not sure what is more sad that you seem to genuinely not understand the issues at hand or that you actually believe some of the absolute pap you've posted in this thread.
If ever there was a need for a 'FAIL' smiley now would be the time.
I'm not trying to be provocative. I'm simply asking you direct questions based on what you post. You are the one that asserted that European culture is 'superior' to other cultures.
Sadly you don't have a very well thought definition of culture. You don't seem to really have thought much past the one line answer you provided. This is the root of the issue and probably much of the reason why your logic is so incredibly warped on this particular subject.
Umm... so Europe never had any of those problems right? Child marriage? Sweet Jesus... Europe wouldn't have had half the dynasties or royal lineages it had throughout it's history had it not been for child brides. Is your coofftopicnd of the history of your beloved "superior culture" so poor that you really can't see that? Honor killings? You don't think Europe has had equally barbaric practices? I think you need to post online less and bone up on your history. You could go on and on but my guess is that it'd be equally as easy to pick apart whatever argument you came up with as you try to shore up your dreams of superiority. Guess you've never heard of The House of Habsburg or the Habsburg Lip/Jaw... my God that type of thin only happens in the castes of dirty savages and their inferior cultures... ughh... has someone counted the silverware recently!?
Ah so you some from an immigrant family yourself. So wait a minute... if you culture is so superior then why did you have to move from Ireland? Surely your superior culture would have provided you with all the means to live a satisfying and fruitful life right without having to go take land from those savages with their inferior culture and barbaric practices right?
Yeah those savages and their barbaric practices would have never amounted to anything so you and your lot with superior culture are the natural and rightful people to control and run the show right? You're as racist as you are ignorant.
Well wait a minute... what happend to your fairytale land of cultural superiority. Surely with that abundance of superiority something should have been figured out without your lot having to move away.
Your posts in this thread alone pretty much show your attitudes toward immigrants or anyone who's not Western European. The irony is you yourself are an immigrant but you try to justify it every which way but loose. I'm not sure what is more sad that you seem to genuinely not understand the issues at hand or that you actually believe some of the absolute pap you've posted in this thread.
If ever there was a need for a 'FAIL' smiley now would be the time.