Are we spoiled?

[popeyethesadist]

And your information comes from where exactly? Really, I'd love to see you cite some sources for your opinions, since you're so happy to criticise other's.



School - where equal opportunities apply. Colleges and universities (UK remember - different things) have many of the same problems, but can be a little more selective at least.

 

[TanyaB]

if you have any concerns of the sources that wiki uses you can always click the references and look at the original documents.
Also if you can find a better source that quickly gives you a brief run down of all the information available on the topic, please tell me. id be interested to see something that covers the scope of topics wiki does.

the question i was asking was:
define advances.
how do you (personally) measure advances of a country/culture or civilisation?

as the wiki links i posted earlier show, there are many ways to define "development" and "advances"

 

[oknightsofni]

lol... wait a minute... just a few posts ago you were saying that you got all your information from you friend first hand. Of which it turned out to be completely wrong... go back and reread the section where you posted that Persians were Semitic peoples.

But now you're trying to snag someone on their sources.

You go write that article on 'Western European cultural superiority' and see how long it stays on Wikipedia before you get read the riot act of reality.

 

[Hermione]

Ah yes...but within the context of this debate that's very much the point. Because in the life expectancy gains we are on about when comparing western cultures to less developed ones is very much about just increasing longevity across the board rather than adding a few more crappy years at the end.
And also....while the last fews years you may call infirm and not really an improvement I'm not seeing masses of 70 year olds offing themselves becuase of it.
5 more years in a wheelchair is still 5 more years seeing your grandkids growing up.
I think you are being overly "down" on those last years of life. I think when you are 85 and can be given another year you'll take it.

 

[dietricklynn]

You mean aside from all the technological advances? How about increased standard of living, increased life expectancy, democratically elected governments, equal rights and opportunities for all citizens. Do you need any more?

 

[EleaticStranger]

That's true of unreferenced articles, but 99.9% of the articles of wikipedia are well referenced and the material easily verifiable. Dismissing the points because they are backed by wikipedia is weak.

 

[balibee]

He didn't tell me Persians are semetic. He did tell me of their dislike of Arabs which if you recall was the answer to your question about got my info about that. You do remember the question you asked right?

 

[AlexisInfectious®]

But in the western cultures it's much more adding years to the end, rather than preventing infants from dying. They're not comparable.



Bear in mind that it's illegal to do so, or to assist in it. Look at the euthanasia movements - there's enough people supporting it that it's actually getting to the point where the government will need to debate it, seriously.



If your mind's together enough to appreciate it, yes.



Actually when I'm 85 if I'm in the same state as my grandfather was at 72, I very much doubt I would take that extra year. Unfortunately by the time I'm in that state I won't be considered mentally competent to make a decision about whether I live or die (assuming the state legalise it) and wouldn't be capable of taking action myself in defiance of the law.

If on the other hand research is put into improving the healthy life expectancy rather than just throwing a few years of near-pointless existence on then yes, I would very much take it. Of course by then it'll probably be a case of work until you drop (not that I consider that a bad thing).

 

[nzxos]

That's opening up a whole new can of worms.



How about it? How do you measure that? Wealth? Possessions? Energy consumption? Amount of anti-depressants prescribed?



Not necessarily a good thing. See above.



Oh goodie. Ignorant masses get to elect smart, charismatic, power-hungry people to make their decisions for them. Not a sign of progress unless you automatically assume that democracy is a good thing in its own right - it's better than many other options, but not the best system.



If we had these, I'd agree with you. Frankly however these do not exist.



Yes. Rational governmental decisions rather than ones based on emotive response. A sensible currency system which actually has a base unit of value instead of being backed by imaginary numbers. Forward-looking and imaginative research programs instead of ones selected to fulfil a political agenda. A good, broad, and highly flexible educational system that ensures all are educated to the best of the abilities, talents and interests. A medical system which performs sensible triage and management of resources, and feeds in information about patient comfort instead of simply health. A benefit system capable of catching those who have slipped, without providing a lifestyle for those who have walked downwards. Rational decisions about what to do about those who are net losses to society, such as criminals, so as to either dispose of them or make them somehow into net gains.

I would go on, but I need to lock up the office.

 

[AVB]

yeah you do.
a lot more.
theres many more measures than those 4.
Cost of resource depletion
Cost of crime
Cost of ozone depletion
Cost of family breakdown
Cost of air, water, and noise pollution
Loss of farmland
Loss of wetlands

Theres more than this

democracy doesnt mean anything of how a population is developed.
how about: ecological footprint per capita? medical care available?

western countries all fail there.

vietnam and cuba do well. and they're communist.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Happy_Planet_Index

according to happy planet Cuba is a great place. why wouldnt it be? great health care, equal right and opportunities, good support for those who need it.

 

[vnethirajan]

Yes standard of living certainly involves wealth and possesions and energy consumption. Depression is biochemical. No cure for that yet.
You think the masses are ignorant but you are smart? You must be very egotistical.
As for education you do know what colleges and unis are for right? They are for people to study in their field of interest and earn a degree.
We haven't created a utopian society yet and maybe never will but don't ignore all the progress we have made.

 

[surelysoprano]

If you're worried about your carbon footprint i suggest you try not to step in any carbon. I suspect you're one of those envirowackos who wants to put me out of a job. I work for Shell.

 

[mexican_missez]

Ahhhh... thank you for that clarification on exactly which info he passed onto you first hand. Ironically you could have easily looked up the information on whether or not Persians are considered Semitic peoples either linguistically or culturally on Wikipedia.

 

[MikkiSue71]

My Dear, dear man, a most worthy comment.

The Bear.

 

[clovicat]

You work at a gas station? Maybe every time you pump unleaded for your customers you run by your Euro-cultural-superiority schtick by them and see how it flies.

 

[ThatKat]

I had a roomate from India. She marvelled at things i take for granted like abundant electricity even in rural areas, fresh clean water, good housing, almost everyone has a car. She came from a country that lacks those things and where many people are lucky to own a moped much less a car. She got me to thinking maybe i shouldn't take things for granted so much.

 

[newbythecomic]

of all the things i posted you pick up only on 2 words?
no im not at envirowacko.
like most people my age im concerned about the resources we have left and what we can do for the future.
carbon footprint counts deforestation also.
and as you might not know - we need trees for air.

 

[Megkaye]

Oh my, we have made absolutely no progress. All we have achieved is mere technology. The same base fundamental nature still drives us today as it did the apes we evolved from. If anything we have become less aware of our nature and therefore less likely to combat it.

The Bear.

 

[lmd8327]

That doesn't in any way support your warped notion of cultural superiority.

 

[Jaimeliz]

We all are concerned about those things. We need to conserve our resources but also need to sustain our lifestyle. www.shell.com and www.virent.com can get you started on how we are facing the challenge.