Birmingham Riots !

Just because some people consider it "offensive", doesn't automatically make the term invalid.
It is defined as being "A group of islands off the northwest coast of Europe comprising Great Britain, Ireland, and adjacent smaller islands." or something along those lines, that's just the way it is. I'm sorry if people find it offensive, but I can't change facts can I.
 
You've missed my point, which wasn't concerning whether it was offensive or not. Mine was this bit..

it implies continued British sovereignty over the whole of Ireland

Meaning British Sovereignty over the whole of Ireland is no more. Just because its geographically attached to Britain, doesn't mean it automatically is part of it.

There's also a page on it here (as you've probably seen) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Republic_of_Ireland and this page http://www.irlgov.ie/ contains info on the politcal ruling's of Ireland.
 
Whether it implies British sovereignty or not, it makes no difference. The definition still stands, hence Ireland is part of the British Isles.
 
British Sovereignty makes all the difference, without that, then it isn't a part of the British Isles. "Because I say so" isn't a valid debate tactic. How about some evidence, other than a wikipedia link?
 
A wikipedia link IS evidence.

What else can I provide you with?

There is a list of definitions here:
http://www.answers.com/topic/british-isles

All are the same.

Ireland IS part of the British Isles. It's not "because I say so", it's because the standard definition of the term says so.

The point is, there is only one definition of the term "British Isles". And Ireland falls under that definition.

Your argument ranges from the ridiculous to the non-existent. There is a definition of the British Isles. It is a geographical term containing the islands mentioned above. Ireland comes under the range of islands covered by the British Isles, therefore it is in the British Isles. Note I am not saying that it is in the UK, or Great Britain. They are political terms.

If you want to reply your faulty logic to Europe then go ahead.

Switzerland is not part of the European Union (a political term). But it is part of Europe (a geographical term). Using your debating skills, I assume that you would want to exclude Switzerland from being part of Europe, simply because you think it implies that the European Union has sovereignty over it.
 
This is a debate, don't get personal.

Disprove my points. The dates and acts I've provided you with can be looked up in any history book/site, and are real. There's nothing ridiculous or non-existent about them.



So you agree its not in the UK (which was my point from the start by the way, because thats what you seemed to be getting at). Great Britian is as geographical a term as British Isles. Its another name for the collection of Islands that make up Britian and the ROI is not a part of that. Geogrpahically, yes its linked, but so are a lot of countries.



I never mentioned Europe, nor was I going to, so second guessing me on that one was rather pointless. I mentioned the Euro, which is a currency, and yes, thats different to Europe. Sovereignty is linked to Monarchy, if I'm not mistaken, so the EU wouldn't hold Sovereignty anyway, but thats splitting hairs.

I'm going to bed now by the way, so I won't reply till tomorrow. It might be worth another mod splitting this thread too (I can't be bothered to do it)
 
OK before going to bed I should say something.

I believe I see your point, however, we are arguing along completely different lines and hence will not come to an agreement.

You are applying logic to the statement "British Isles". Which, logically, should mean, "Isles which are British". However, as we know, that is not entirely the case. From this POV, saying (Ro) Ireland is in the British Isles is clearly incorrect.

However, from my POV, there is already a definition of what the British Isles mean. I am not looking at the words that make up "British Isles", I'm simply saying - there is a definition, it is widely accepted, and there's we can do about that, therefore Ireland fits this definition and is in the British Isles.

I am looking at the term as a whole and what it is already defined as. You are looking at the words and thinking that they mean something which is clearly incorrect (ie Ireland isn't British).

Along these lines, we'll never agree. So have a nice night.
 
Saz,

Taff is correct about the definition of the British Isles. It is the collective name given to Britain, Ireland, and all the smaller islands around them.

But you have raised an interesting point. What should they be called? I suggest the Celtic Isles.
 
This isn't quite right. Britain is one island. Great Britain is Britain plus the small islands round it (i.e. not including Ireland and the small islands around it) The British Isles include Britain, Ireland and all the small islands around both of them. (Not including the Channel Islands, which are part of the United Kingdom, but not part of the British Isles.)
 
I think the wikipedia description of the term 'outmoded' is quite accurate here, and since the term is a leftover from when Ireland was occupied by the British, maybe it should be changed.
 
That would really get up English noses. Before the English invaded, the British Isles were entirely Celtic. But now of course, they are mostly Anglo-Saxon.
 
Why would it?? Come one now you can't make a blanket staement like that and not follow up!

er ps what's this have to with folks in Brum?
 
Well the population of most of the countries in these islands are still basically Celtic. Hell, half the English people I know are at least partly Irish or Scottish by blood!

I like 'the Celtic Isles'!
 
If we call them the Brummie Isles then would it make you feel better?

Sing along: "Rule Brumtania, Brumtania rules the waves!" etc.
 
Gotta love a thread about the riots in Burmingham that has 4-5 pages of post's that have nothing to do with the riots. Loverly.
 
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