Krav Maga Vs Kempo/Kenpo?

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ShawnT

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Hey I'm looking to go into the military within a few years and I want to have some understanding of a martial arts prior to joining. I've been asking around and I've been told for the military it would be beneficial to learn Krav Maga or Kempo. Which should I learn?
 
ShihanJ insists on repeating inaccurate information. Krav Maga IS NOT a self defense class. To keep insisting that it is is to be dishonest and a little goofy.

It is a well rounded, deep, proven martial art. It has its roots in civilian/self defense use. It was ADAPTED FOR MILITARY USE BY THE IDF. Yes, there are differences between the KM that is used in the military and for civilian use. That does not mean that civilian KM is toned down or watered down or less effective. The military deals with training many people of different levels of intelligence and physical capabilities in a short amount of time. Therefore, the KM that is taught to the average IDF grunt basically a crash course in very basic KM along with some principles that are relevant to military use but not civilian use; ie grenade defense.

Someone who spends several years learning/practicing civilian KM under a legit instructor will most likely have a vastly more formidable understanding of it then your average IDF foot soldier.

As far as KM is concerned, I always recommend trying to find a place that is affiliated with John Whitman's Krav Maga Alliance: http://www.kravmagaalliance.com/ as it will greatly increase the likelihood of finding a legit facility.

All of that being said, your best bet would be to visit facilities of both Kempo AND Krav Maga. Talk with the instructors and students. Take some gratis classes. See which one feels the best to you.

Best of luck.

Edit @ Shihan J: Yeah, a "self defense class" that has a dan 5 black belt ranking (Israeli Krav Maga Association) that takes years to achieve. You are delusional.

Also, once again, you are wrong in saying that KM instructors say it's a "self defense" course. Some, in the KM community will say that it's not a martial art but, rather, a self defense "system". Big difference. Even then, as I've explained before, the whole "it's not a martial art, it's a self defense system" is a marketing ploy propagated by some in the KM community in an attempt to create and exploit a niche outside of traditional martial arts.

It's shorthand for stating that Krav Maga does not do katas, forms, or employ any of the more esoteric aspects of traditional martial arts.

I also have antique books that claim the earth is flat. That does not make the earth flat. Except for, perhaps, you.
 
If you want to train with a similar mindset used in Military training, I'd say Krav Maga as it is taught in a more direct, gross motor skills kind of way. If you just want knowledge of self defense either system would be fine. Additionally, if you choose Krav look for a training facility that works with Law Enforcement. Explain to the instructor your needs (Military) and they may allow you to take the normally separate Law Enforcement classes. This will give you a heavy emphasis on gun disarms, Team strategy for taking a building etc etc. Knowing your needs will at least allow a good instructor to taylor your learning a little better. The hardest part is finding a good instructor. The system doesn't matter if the instruction is poor. If you have an IKMA instructor near you, I've noticed that they train many Law Enforcement agencies as well as having done seminars for Military branches. I've only ever seen Civilian application for Haim Zut KMF schools but the quality is top notch from what I have seen. A school affiliated with Itay Gil's Protect will be most like what you'd look for as his methods are military minded b/c that was where his Krav was learned. IKMF is known for their training of Body guards. Another Poster mentioned John Whitman's Krav Maga Alliance. I've heard good things about Mr. Whitman so that is another option. If none of those options are available then look for the Kempo. I can't speak on groups or instruction with that system so do your research and learn how to weed out the B.S.

Krav is in fact a complete system as is Kempo. IKMA and KMF have developed a civilian System that has moved beyond the the initial training done in Bootcamp to develop systems for long term training and development per the founders vision. The Krav Taught to the Military is indeed limited as it is meant to be learned quickly and effectively in weeks and months and not years. The Civilian version Imi developed continued past this initial phase and introduced a ranking system to acknowledged the Skill sets attained. You will find that Military trained Kravist do in fact study other forms to round out or more accurately fine tune their skills in a specific range. Some like Ran Nakash who was a lead instructor in the IDF is also a professional boxer. Nir Maman (former head of counter terrorism) prior to his affiliation with IKMA was an expert in various forms including Jeet Kune do. You'll find others are experts in Jiu-Jitsu or Judo. These gentleman having learned Krav to use gross motor skills to make them effective quickly later continued their training to refine the fine motor skills. This is different from the Complete long term system developed by the founder for civilian use. In several of these Organizations it can take 10 yrs to reach Black belt and that is not a rank indicating mastering the art. So if you ask Itay Gil or Ran Nakash if Krav is complete. They may say no, it's a highly effective self-defense course (I'm speculating). If you ask Nir Maman, David Kahn, John Whitman or Haim Zut, they will tell you it is a complete and evolving system.

Do your research. Krav has become as broad a term as Kung fu in recent years. All depends on who is teaching regardless of organization. With Kempo's past popularity I'd venture to guess the same holds true. I've listed several Krav sites in sources both military and civilian instructors so you could get a taste of their style. I'm not familiar enough with Kempo to provide legitimate links.
 
Although many people call these "Martial ARTS," they are strictly for self defense. Both styles of fighting are meant to break bones, tear ligaments, etc. and pretty much do whatever you must to survive.
I don't know much about Kempo/Kenpo but I think it is more of an art. Krav Maga, on the other hand, involves simpler (and still as effective) techniques as well as many taken from other fighting styles. It involves using weapons, disarming opponents and hand-to-hand defenses. I also think it is easier to learn.
So I'd say to learn Krav Maga. Its has a wider range of defenses and is very useful.
Hope this helps.
 
kempo is a more complete system the krav maga,
krav maga is a self defense class, for one it is not the same the israeli army uses it is a civil self defense class, most people that teach krav maga, add other martial arts in to fill in the gaps.

the martial arts the military learn are more like a crash course, there main focus is on rifles or other types of guns.

edit:> my information is accurate. it is NOT a martial art, even instructors that teach krav maga say it is a self defense course.
2nd i never said it was it wasn't effective. effectiveness doesn't depend upon style it depends on how you train and how good the instructor is.

pugpaws2 explained it best in his answer on of this question
http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index;_ylt=AqexQYuZ6b4P8zia5i.nsRHty6IX;_ylv=3?qid=20101003080050AAg76fA&show=7#profile-info-cVWOqEJEaa

all because you claim it a martial art doesn't make it so.
i have books on kava maga going back to the 70's explaining its a self defense course and an old military training manual of this in my library
 
kempo is a more complete system the krav maga,
krav maga is a self defense class, for one it is not the same the israeli army uses it is a civil self defense class, most people that teach krav maga, add other martial arts in to fill in the gaps.

the martial arts the military learn are more like a crash course, there main focus is on rifles or other types of guns.

edit:> my information is accurate. it is NOT a martial art, even instructors that teach krav maga say it is a self defense course.
2nd i never said it was it wasn't effective. effectiveness doesn't depend upon style it depends on how you train and how good the instructor is.

pugpaws2 explained it best in his answer on of this question
http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index;_ylt=AqexQYuZ6b4P8zia5i.nsRHty6IX;_ylv=3?qid=20101003080050AAg76fA&show=7#profile-info-cVWOqEJEaa

all because you claim it a martial art doesn't make it so.
i have books on kava maga going back to the 70's explaining its a self defense course and an old military training manual of this in my library
 
Semantics issues aside, Krav Maga and Kenpo ARE different in their training approaches.

Krav Maga takes a more direct route, with a curriculum consisting almost exclusively of techniques that are more readily applicable in actual self defense, with a training program intended to teach these skills in as short a time frame as possible. The style was born during warfare, and the sense of urgency at that time meant that this approach would allow Krav Maga to actually be useful to as much people as possible.

Kenpo, on the other hand, has gone through centuries of refinement, culminating in a complete art. It's training method - as in other classical arts - is akin to higher education in universities: the focus is on a deep level of understanding of the art as a whole. Practical self-defense application is but one of the goals. Training will also include a significant amount of exercises and drills, repeated endlessly in order for the practitioner to make the art a second nature.

So, which one should you learn? First of all, it depends on what you want: Do you want to commit yourself to a long-term training regimen that will only pay off after years of study? Or do you prefer something simpler with a narrower focus?

You'll also need to take into consideration what kinds of schools are available near where you live: training schedules, fees, the quality and personality of the instructor, the general training atmosphere of the school, etc., etc. So, try to visit a couple of places, sit through a class or two, take a trial class if its available, and pick one you like best.
 
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