Man arrested for 2x4 labeled "High Powered Rifle"

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Flyinghorse

New member
Man arrested for 2x4 labeled "High Powered Rifle"

I'm not clear how his dissent was silenced. You found a link to his story easily enough. Hell, it seems to me that getting caught and arrested is hardwired into the whole "protest" idea. Whether you think he's a jerk or not is up for debate. (I wouldn't have gone this route personally.) But his message found an audience precisely because he was "caught" and arrested. Just as was the case for innumerable protests in the past. Without that element, we'd just have nameless, faceless people chained to trees, hanging about naked in office lobbies, etc.

If this guy set out without considering 1) the possibility and 2) the desirability of being arrested, I'd have to consider the possibility that the 2x4 was the brains of this operation.
 
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PelMel

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Man arrested for 2x4 labeled "High Powered Rifle"

I've spent a good amount of time in Wyoming and I found the folks incredibly welcoming and pleasant. I found people a whole lot more hostile to non-locals in major cities like Boston than I've ever found to be the case in small-town Wyoming or Oregon.



At my local Fred Meyer (a big-box-and-grocery store), I can buy a circular saw, baby diapers and formula, and a case of beer all in one location at the same time. If I use them all at once, it's, well, it's a big problem. But who says you're going to use it at the same time just because you're buying it from one convenient location?

If someone spends the afternoon at the range or hunting, and the evening drinking beers, there's nothing wrong with that, right?
 
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Vikkip67

Member
Man arrested for 2x4 labeled "High Powered Rifle"

Looks like Senator Feinstein of California may be looking to ban most rifles and handguns (semi-automatic is quite a common type of action among most guns out there these days), and magazines with capacity over 10 rounds, and thumbhole stocks, among other things.

Here's her suofftopicry of the upcoming bill she seeks:

http://www.feinstein.senate.gov/public/index.cfm/files/serve/?File_id=10993387-5d4d-4680-a872-ac8ca4359119

Not sure how much of the "exemptions" listed are better described as "spin" on her part, though. There's not much detail in the suofftopicry, so I'm left guessing about some things.

Those who oppose this bill might want to act quickly.

Curiously, if C-Span can be trusted, Sen. Feinstein has had a carry permit in the past, and may or may not still have one now.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B1EObqM9Z0s (especially after 0:57)
 
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SugarplumFairy

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Man arrested for 2x4 labeled "High Powered Rifle"

a) She's hardcore gun control, so what did you expect?
b) It's doubtful this particular bill will even get a vote in the Democrat controlled Senate
c) It wont pass the house. End of story.
d) Most bills start off too extreme (too ideological), then they get redrafted until they are either passable or discarded.


Not sure how this is relevant unless she had a carry permit for one of the weapons she is trying to have banned.
 
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FreedomJunky

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Man arrested for 2x4 labeled "High Powered Rifle"

This is the sort of reasonable regulation that most responsible gun owners would support.

We should apply what we learned in terms of legislating alcohol. Regulation works; prohibition does not (at least not in the USA; different countries with different circumstances may find differently).
 
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Kathij

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Man arrested for 2x4 labeled "High Powered Rifle"

This is a crazy bill. Banning all semi-automatic weapons with exemptions granted for over 900 existing models "used for hunting or sporting purposes"? Sounds to me like this protects existing models but prevents refinement and improvement. Completely screws up the firearms industry but doesn't notably change what's available for sale.

This is a classic example of knee-jerk band-aid legislation. Makes people "feel like they're doing something" but has no tangible benefit. Just like how my gentlemanly parts get frisked before I get on an airplane.
 
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LittleLulu

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Man arrested for 2x4 labeled "High Powered Rifle"

It's worse than that. This is the sort of law that gets passed when government feels the need to look like they've solved the problem. But in reality have done absolutely nothing. At least a band-aid type of law would do some good in the short term.
 
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ronaifrilter

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Man arrested for 2x4 labeled "High Powered Rifle"

That's not what the bill says. She's banning semi-automatic weapons with detachable magazines that also have a military characteristic (a term I assume is either defined elsewhere or in the bill itself).

Why do civilians need detachable magazines?

And the firearms industry will adapt or die, just like every other industry.
 
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khaleel

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Man arrested for 2x4 labeled "High Powered Rifle"

How does the banning of high capacity magazines and assault rifles not mitigate the problem of people using them to kill people, as in Aurora?
 
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wariya

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Man arrested for 2x4 labeled "High Powered Rifle"

The problem I have with the law is not the banning of high-capacity magazines, but the fact that the law is built primarily around a 120 "specifically banned" models list and a 900-model "specifically allowed" models list. If a rule (like Feinstein's rule) that requires 900+ models to be excepted from the rule, there's something fundamentally wrong with the way the rule itself is crafted.

I also have a problem with the fact taht this is re-adopting the infamous "military characteristics" list of the AWB (which made cosmetic differences illegal). Pistol grips and accessory rails don't kill people. If the Aurora shooter had had six-round magazines instead of a 100-round drum magazine, it would have made a difference. If he had had a Ruger Mini-14 Ranch Rifle fed by a 100-round drum instead of an AR-15 fed by a 100-round drum, no, it wouldn't have made a lick of difference...so why focus on the ergonomic differences between the Mini-14 Ranch Rifle and the AR-15? Yet the bulk of Feinstein's law is based on trying to separate the AR-15s from the Ruger Mini-14 Ranch Rifles because the AR-15 basically looks scarier.

The only part of Feinstein's law that I think would be effective is the ban on high-capacity magazines. But if we're giong to ban them, we need to ban them outright (perhaps through a mandatory buy-back program) instead of including the grandfather clause because there are so many in circulation that the grandfather clause emasculates the ban. So even the one part of the law that actually might make a difference is totally neutered.
 
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cryptic

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Man arrested for 2x4 labeled "High Powered Rifle"

And if she didn't include those 900 exceptions you'd be complaining that the rules are too rigid and you'd be citing examples of weapons being unnecessarily banned.


What about the background check and registration changes, which it seems, extends to private sales and transfers?
 
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cornstalk

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Man arrested for 2x4 labeled "High Powered Rifle"

Don't put words in my mouth...at least not if you're intending on debating instead of soap-boxing. If a rule is well-crafted, it shouldn't require 900 exceptions in the first place. She's got a vastly over-aggressive rule that she's trying to patch by letting through nearly a thousand models that don't fit the rule.



That'd help with other sorts of crime but generally not with these mass shootings. Most mass shooters have totally clean records before the massacre and lawfully purchased the firearms--whether we're talking Aurora, Virginia Tech, or University of Texas. Or they're stolen from someone who did obtain it legally (like in Connecticut). So while I'm in favor of background checks and closing the gun show loophole (check my own plan several pages back), no, I don't think it would have made a lick of difference in Aurora.
 
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easty

New member
Man arrested for 2x4 labeled "High Powered Rifle"

Have you seen the list of 900? Now you're putting words in her mouth. There may be perfectly reasonable reasons why those models are exempt.


It wont stop all mass murders, but it might stop other gun crime which results in thousands of deaths a year.

As horrible as it was, Sandy hook wasn't even the tip of the gun crime iceberg.
 
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clootch

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Man arrested for 2x4 labeled "High Powered Rifle"

She hasn't published the list. I've looked for it but it's just not out there. The sheer number of exceptions to the rule that even Feinstein (who has spearheaded poorly-thought-out firearms legislation before) thinks are necessary, though, is evidence that the rule is sweepingly overbroad.



And if it's an over-aggressive law that infringes on weapons used for lawful self-defense in areas where police response times are inadequate (i.e., most of rural America), it might just as easily cause an increase in fatalities per year...but they'll be one-at-a-time deaths in felonies in rural America that won't ever hit national headlines. But just because you don't hear about those deaths in assaults, robberies, and home invasions in the international news doesn't mean they aren't happening.

I'm not opposed to additional firearms regulations. But it needs to be well-thought-out and moderate to address those competing policies. Nothing about Feinstein's proposal indicates that it is.
 
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DaniCalifornia

Member
Man arrested for 2x4 labeled "High Powered Rifle"

The bill hasn't been published yet, then, so it's all conjecture at this point.

You don't need a detachable magazine for self defence. If 10 bullets don't do the job, you're probably already dead.

Who else has put a proposal forward? If someone else puts forward a better proposal, then it will kill Feinstein's bill, but if everyone else keeps quiet, then you get what you're given.
 
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CarliG

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Man arrested for 2x4 labeled "High Powered Rifle"

As was pointed out to me by several individuals on various forums after I made my initial proposal, semi-automatic feed mechanisms are essentially impossible to maintain and clean without the detachable magazine. So if you're banning detachable magazines, you're effectively banning semi-automatic firing mechanisms. And there are several advantages of semi-automatic firearms over revolvers for self-defense:

(1) Greater barrel length for a given size of firearm. A conceal-carry-sized revolver generally has a 1.875" barrel. A conceal-carry-sized semi-automatic pistol generally has a 3" barrel. Greater barrel length = greater accuracy, which means more effective self-defense and less likelihood of a stray shot and the consequences thereof.

(2) More controllable recoil. The barrel of a semi-automatic pistol is nearer to the center axis of your hand-arm than the barrel of a revolver. This means that the revolver kicks more up whereas the pistol's kick is more straight back. The latter is easier to control and has less effect on the accuracy of a second shot.

(3) Physical safeties. Revolvers don't have 'em.

(4) The "if you don't get them in X shots, you're dead anyway" assumes we're talking about a toe-to-toe exchange with one person, not multiple attackers or someone firing from behind cover. That's not always a safe assumption. It's the firearm equivalent of saying you don't need grappling because you can end a fight with one punch. That's sometimes true but certainly not always, and for self-defense, you shouldn't assome that "sometimes" will be your circumstance. A quick reload after X shots matters if you end up needing X+1 shots for self-defense.



Numerous individuals and organizations have put forth proposals focused on improving law enforcement presence. I fully support that. Most Americans do as far as I can tell.

In addition, Rep. Diana DeGette and Rep. Carolyn McCarthy have a more moderate proposal than Feinstein's proposal; it would ban high-capacity magazines (which they define as over ten rounds of ammunition) without entering into this game of banning some, but not all, semi-auto weapons simply because they're semi-automatic. I've got no problem with their proposal. Their proposal has widespread Democratic support and some Republican support.
 
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HOCKEYLOVER

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Man arrested for 2x4 labeled "High Powered Rifle"

I don't understand why it wouldn't be a good idea to place security guards with guns in elementary schools. In the USA that is. Doing that in Europe may actually have the negative effects people are talking about. And I'm not talking about guards with miniguns and light machine guns. Just simple handguns should do the job nicely.

The USA is more pro gun than any other country in the world, so naturally their children are going to get confronted with guns anyway. But somehow confronting these kids with guns at their schools, where they are the most vulnerable, is a bad idea?

I've seen illogical arguments before, but this one is a real winner.

I hate to call it, but it sounds like a woman's argument.

America, man up and protect your children. What the hell are you guys doing up there?!!
 
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