There is No Such Thing as Race

The only reason this started was because different coloured skin people were cautious of eachother. White people met asianic people... asianic people decided they weren't right and killed them all, white people wanted their holy land back etc...

In this day and age what does ethnic minority matter anyway. There are so many laws against you being able to even call a Black Board a black board whats gunna happen?
 
I find it an insult that someone would even try to say that race isn't real, or try to prove it with science. nothing can change the fact that my ancestors were hosed, wipped, beaten, killed, raped, hung, linched, butchered, and worked to death becuase they were seen as less human. To say that there is no such things and race is to say that all the sacrifices my ancestors made is in vain.

people of any race other then the prefered white will. 1: be garanteed to be a victim of some form of racism during the first 15 years of their life. 2: will make less money then a white male. 3: will have less educational opportunities.

i myself am victim to a slew of racial jokes, nicknames, insults, and harassments just for being the son of a white male and a black female.

being black has been a daily struggle for me, even when dealing with people who i wouldn't view as racist or a bigot, even my best friend. i am a big enough person that i can deal with this stuff, but that doesn't mean that it isn't real.

Melanin may make our skins different, but it doesn't change the fact that my face if different, my hands are different, my eyes and my throat, a lot of things about me are different from the people i have to deal with, and they don't even understand that their words will hurt me in a way that is impossible for them to understand.

and the fact is that race has to be talked about, you can't avoid it, and it comes up often. Such as my studies of Asian cultures, no matter what i do, i will never be able to understand south korean culture the way my south korean friends do.

and the fact that i can't even hate the people who insult me like this burns me up inside. becuase of all the love and compassion i give to the people around me do to my religious upbringing, even though my religion constantly refuses to help those who aren't of the prefered white.

Until you can prove to me that the emotions i feel and the pride i have in my difference isn't special at all, and is just an illusion created by fake feelings of sacrifice, no-one should ever believe that race isn't real, and that being genetically alike will make it so that i am treated as an equal.

if you wanna try to prove to me that race isn't real, i suggest you start now, and dis-include genetics and the Melanocyte. ( those won't stop a klan member from hurting me if you explain it to them.) Those things don't get people to treat me the same as others.

Race is real and you have to accept it, don't use science-use your eyes, know that they are different despite genetics, and accept them, don't make excuses for your hidden spite.
 
You're missing my entire point. Race is a mental/ cultural construct--it is not real.

The torture your relatives face, and the bigotry you faced, is caused by the delusion that race is real. That we're "different" when we are all the same.

What I suggest does not erase the pain inflicted on your ancestors--it exposes the complete stupidity of those who committed it!

Don't fall into the same trap...
 
Originally Posted by LoChu
Race and nation are human constructs which in the scheme of things are meaningless.

What if humans can someday change their skin color like they currently can with hair color? That could have a profound affect on notions of race. Aesthetically speaking I think it would be kinda cool.
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Michael Jackson has done it and so have others. But they don't have this gene.


This is interesting,
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2005/12/15/AR2005121501728.html

The race seems to be who can obliterate who faster. Hair is another thing that is very complex it is tied in with feathers also.

Gary
 
Hi I just copied and pasted because it was on this page, I did not want to go look for it
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Originally Posted by Abdiel
I find it an insult that someone would even try to say that race isn't real, or try to prove it with science. nothing can change the fact that my ancestors were hosed, wipped, beaten, killed, raped, hung, linched, butchered, and worked to death becuase they were seen as less human. To say that there is no such things and race is to say that all the sacrifices my ancestors made is in vain.

people of any race other then the prefered white will. 1: be garanteed to be a victim of some form of racism during the first 15 years of their life. 2: will make less money then a white male. 3: will have less educational opportunities.

i myself am victim to a slew of racial jokes, nicknames, insults, and harassments just for being the son of a white male and a black female.

being black has been a daily struggle for me, even when dealing with people who i wouldn't view as racist or a bigot, even my best friend. i am a big enough person that i can deal with this stuff, but that doesn't mean that it isn't real.

Melanin may make our skins different, but it doesn't change the fact that my face if different, my hands are different, my eyes and my throat, a lot of things about me are different from the people i have to deal with, and they don't even understand that their words will hurt me in a way that is impossible for them to understand.

and the fact is that race has to be talked about, you can't avoid it, and it comes up often. Such as my studies of Asian cultures, no matter what i do, i will never be able to understand south korean culture the way my south korean friends do.

and the fact that i can't even hate the people who insult me like this burns me up inside. becuase of all the love and compassion i give to the people around me do to my religious upbringing, even though my religion constantly refuses to help those who aren't of the prefered white.

Until you can prove to me that the emotions i feel and the pride i have in my difference isn't special at all, and is just an illusion created by fake feelings of sacrifice, no-one should ever believe that race isn't real, and that being genetically alike will make it so that i am treated as an equal.

if you wanna try to prove to me that race isn't real, i suggest you start now, and dis-include genetics and the Melanocyte. ( those won't stop a klan member from hurting me if you explain it to them.) Those things don't get people to treat me the same as others.

Race is real and you have to accept it, don't use science-use your eyes, know that they are different despite genetics, and accept them, don't make excuses for your hidden spite.
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I watched a movie last night called the "Shadowboxer", I believe it is the new way to promote, killing, sex, and mixed bag of relations between young, and old. Plus of course everyone loved Black and White mixture's and fat Black women with skinny white men. LOL...

http://www.shadowboxerthefilm.com/

Pure crap in my humble opinion. Sad the way the movie industry is trying to homogonize us all.

You are obviously very troubled over who you are, you should try and get over it, and get on with a good life. Get educated and become someone you respect.

Start by moving to the west coast and going to a university there, or just a college. You will be surprised at what is happening.

Gary
 
just becuase you believe that it is a human construct doesn't meen it isn't real. I am different, i like being different, that fact that i have a race that is my own and helps define my personality makes me feel great and happy.

Any person of a race that is confinced that race isn't real has lost one of the happiest and joyous aspects of their life.

Micheal Jackson wouldn't have bleached his skin if he didn't have that horrible skin disease. friends of his had testified how hard it was for him to make that decision. He was proud of his race, and his race was one of the final extablished things that kept him happy, given his delicate mental condition.

Being a proud Black man means i wouldn't trade this human contruct for anything, despite the pain it puts us through, haveing that pain and surviveing proves to us that we are strong enough to survive any crossroad we come to, as there are maybe one or two harder situations any one person can experience in a life time.

so what if you can someday change your appearance, that doesn't change what you are or the strength you can gain from it. human contructs are some of the greatest things we have on this planet, without human contructs we would never have had love, or understanding of the universe, or hope for something greater and get it. Without the human contruct, the creature known as homo-erectus ( actual creature, pre-homosapian) would have died out, or never have even existed.

don't call the people who inflicted pain on my people stupid, i don't view them as stupid, they did what they believed in, though their beliefs were misguided, it doesn't meen that they were idiotic,

I have fallen into no trap, I have built a bridge over the hole and stood in the center of it. Accepting all that is beneath, around, above, and within me.

I know who i am, i have accepting who i am, and i love who i am. moveing to the west coast and attending a college won't help, colleges and universities always try to seem un-bias to any race, and thus can form the appearence of equality without acknowledgement of race. ( colleges and universities will put on a mask to blind them from race, and leave 2 little eye holes that don't go noticed by everyone around them.)

and the movie industry does homogonize (i hope i spell't that correctly, i'ts late out here, i think well, but i don't spell well.) the population, but in small doses everywhere those situations can and does happen, (the bad the good and the controversial.) But alas the movie is


well i guess that i should check back in the morning, since no one is makeing a reply, and i mean my morning which will take a little while.( 5 hours) after this forum's morning.

Try not to talk to much at me, so i can actually reply in some way without being overwhelmed without getting tongue tied.
 
Yes, but in doing this, it seems like you have given up any hope of doingf anything for yourself. You say you won't go to college because of racial bias. Why not? How is not going to college and staying in a place where there is racial bias going to be any better? At least by going to college you can live in an area with racial bias but have greater prospects. Not going to college is not a bad thing - many people do not wish to go as they have a different career/life plan already set out. But not going because you feel that there is racial bias seems to completely miss the point of equality. How can racial bias in colleges, the work place, etc, be smashed if the very people who are subjected to such bias do not attend?

Sometimes, Racism is what you make it

Em
 
i don't refuse to go to college becuase of the racial bias, i refuse to go to a college for the purpose of being convinced that race isn't seen anymore. I still attend college courses.

you say i gave up in doing anything for myself, i still do the things that help me, and the things that must be done to progress, i just do it in a state of hieghtened awarness and acceptence.

Martin Luther King Jr. said that we should love our differences, and come together as many different peoples in one society.

Just the same with the country we call the United States, many seperate, self governed, states with different looks, ways of speaking, and values. But all part of one-single-and great nation.

To say that we as a race have no difference then other people is like saying that the execution policies of Nebraska is identical to Texas executing the retarded.
 
I guess if you are retarded and kill you should do it in another location, don't go to Texas I'd say.

Many move to certain locations and are just looking for a job, while others go to a certain state to flee the laws of other locations.

OJ Simpson, comes to mind.

You need to read more and harbor bad feelings less, I notice that counseling is on the rise.

If you truly want to help, then find a job where you will make a positive impact on others who are less fortunate. Some turn to religion while others feel that is a real cop-out.

Seek what you are so disgusted with, try to help make it a better location for those who are still stuck. You will find that the biggest problem for most is they realize they are stuck and have no hope. Maybe you can help.

Race:
This is pretty easy to understand...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Race

Read it.

Gary
 
ok, you have gotten way

i have no anger towards anyone, not even those of you who are talking about how race doesn't exist, i have pity. You need to stop telling me that i need to adjust my life. You need to stop telling me that i need to get councelling when i'm seeing extremely clearly.

I am already a religious person, as i have previously testified, and i am constantly trying to improve the conditions in which the people around me are living in.

And as any 9th grade debate class teacher will tell you, wikipedia is not a source of facts, when it comes to open ended topics it is simply a collection of opinions, and not an eligible source of facts.

what i'm disgusted with are the people who try to tell me that i'm not different or that i'm not unique thanks to my race, i love my difference and no-one should ever try to convince a person that their race isn't special.

Stop trying to think you know whats wrong with my life and realise that you have to accept people's differences, and not hide behind a viel of science and humans haveing flaws, maybe you should look to see that maybe this belief that race doesn't exist is your one of your flaws.
 
Abidel - Gary wasn't the one who came into this thread telling us about his life. That was you. When you do that, people are going to draw conclusions from what you have posted.

I myself have been the victim of racism. Racism is a fact. As is race. Whether it is biological or cultural doesn't matter, it is a fact. However, there is a line to how far people should take their beliefs on race. Some white man may not like a black man because he is black. That's okay. As animals, we are naturally predisposed to not trusting something different to ourselves. However, acting upon that dislike is crossing the line. So the KKK etc are way over the line. However, this line works both ways. I, as a Romani, expect to be exposed to a certain degree of predjudice. I may not like it, but I expect it to happen. I may go around and help people who have been victims of race crime, or teach people about racism. That is also fine. I can even resent people of other races. However, the line can be crossed when I act upon that resentment. There is a fine line between racial pride and racism.

Em
 
Ok, so I think we can pretty much establish that you are in fact from the North American continent or there about and are under two decades old. With that being the case, listen carefully: YOU HAVE NOT EXPERIENCED RACISM! Maybe your grandparents experienced it, but you have no clue about what real oppression is.

What you are describing is the pretty standard majority-group rejection that EVERYONE faces. It happens because you're too short, too tall, not smart enough, too smart, because you are Christian, because you aren't Christian etc… Everyone gets to play odd man out at some point; you learn from it and move on.

EVERY RACE AND NATION ON THE PLANET HAS VICTIMIZED ANOTHER RACE OR NATION AT SOME POINT AND HAS BEEN VICTIMIZED BY ANOTHER RACE OR NATION. The human race has not always had its best foot forward.

In the world there is only one "preferred color" that determines how you are treated and that color is the color of currency. Money talks and you know the rest…

Maybe some day we'll get past this phase too.
 
ok, first off, i just casually mentioned a few things about myself originally, i wasn't the one suggesting that someone should move to the west coast, go to a knew college, get religious, and do charity, just becuase i said that they need to acknowledge the existence of race and accept it.

I'm glad that i am finally talking to someone who acknowledges race, but dislikeing someone of a different race is not a natural thing, in the 1st grade class that i occasionally visit to assist the kids, these kids had no fear or care of the difference of race or any other differences in their class.

It was obvious that they could see it as they would talk about it, but if it is a nature of humans, it WILL be naturally conducted by children. Yes you accept that racism and bigotry is real, but that doesn't mean that it is o.k. on any degree. The feelings of a person who dislikes a group of people and hides it are no different then of those of a person who stand on a stage, burn a Japanese flag, and use a slew of certain non-socially acceptable words.

And you are not one to determine whether i have experienced racism, do not assume that every person has a standard experience the same as every other person. Stop trying to get into my perosnal life, race is real, you have admitted it. and all i'm saying is that haveing a race is a good that must be accepted by the population.

And just becuase everyone of a group will experience it at a degree does not meen it isn't racism or bigotry.
 
Race is real and it makes us unique, whether you wan tto believe in it or not, whether you hate it or accept it. Race is real and people can be racist, or have caution to a race, that never makes it ok. and you should never accept any forms of racism. whether it be saying people of a race are inferior or that they are no more unique then anyone else.
 
First off, we need to realize exactly what racism, nationalism, etc. are. They are both a social and biological mechanism.

First, we come to our ancestors: primates. Primates organized themselves into social groups. This was the norm for them. The moment they did this, they automatically had something in common with other members of their group. When another group appears, there is automatically a level of caution, because that group is trying to get the same things (food, water, mating, etc.) that the first group wants.

This group mentality was to protect them from things outside their group, things like predators. Over time, however, primates evolved, but the gene that made a group mentality continued to run. So, humans naturally form groups with other human beings. When they do this, they are automatically cautious and wary of people from other groups, on a subconscious level.

Next, I direct you to the monkeysphere: http://www.pointlesswasteoftime.com/monkeysphere.html

If you read the article, you will realize that humans don't just stick to one group. They are in several groups, some of which they have more in common with, and some of which they have less in common with. The former group will inspire more loyalty than the latter.

For example, if I and another American are walking around, say, Iraq, and a random Al-Qaeda terrorist attacks the other guy, I will help him, because I have a lot in common with him (we're both American and all that comes with that). In this case, I am grouping myself with him, and setting myself against the group of "terrorists".

On the other hand, if I happen to be in the vicinity of just said terrorist, and an extraterrestrial HellBeast attacks the terrorist, I will help the terrorist, not the alien. Why? Because I have more in common with the terrorist. We are of the same species, and live on the same planet.

In much the same way, we group ourselves with others who have similar interests/features/social status/etc. Our subconscious brains don't care that race doesn't exist. They simply see common features and roll with them.

On the other hand, upbringing plays a big role in this as well. Let's look at the old world, shall we? Let's take Europeans as an example. Back in the day when the churches controlled everything, and what they taught was widespread belief, Europeans began to have contact with black Africans.

During this time, it was commonly accepted that the color black and darkness were associated with Satan/evil. So, when many churchgoing Europeans saw blacks for the first time, this conditioning kicked in, and racism started busting out. Some of them had lots of self-control, and didn't show any racism. They were, however, still thinking it on a subconscious level. It can't be helped.

In much the same way, what we do is shaped by these genes, as well as our upbringing. For example, what do many racists have in common? Who did they grow up around, and who do they hang out with? Other racists of the same race!

On the other hand, when a person is raised in a multi-cultural setting that is anti-racist, they automatically group themselves with the anti-racists. Once again, we are seeing the effect of social constructs on the monkeysphere.

So, in conclusion, we are basically doing a combination of what we were exposed to growing up, and what our monkey brains are telling us to do. All of it is on a subconscious level. We can pretend not to group ourselves like that, and say "I'm not racist/nationalist/whateverist and accept everyone for who they are!!", but in the end you still think it.

I know there are going to be some people who respond to this and say "Blargh, u r a terrlbe racst OMGZ!!! I nevar do thnk bad about otharz!!!", but they will still know that what I said is a fact. Even if you don't consciously believe it, on a subconscious level, you still group yourselves, and are naturally wary of other groups.
 
Race doesn't make you unique a combination of genetics and personality make you unique. It's an, at best fuzzy, social grouping based on ethnic origin and characterised, by and large, by stereotypes. Race makes people feel like they belong (for more details seen ninjapiratecaptain's post which is pretty much spot on).

I'm not sure I agree that race isn't 'real' it is certainly intangible and largely meaningless but depending on how you define it it means something whether the distinction it defines is worthwhile defining is another matter. I wouldn't say that race doesn't exist, rather that race is a redundant concept.
 
Fine i give up, one person can't change the minds of stuborn false geneticists, i can only hope that you'll stop thinking like scientists and begin to think like humans, with your soul, not your brain.

(at least not with your brain all the time.)
 
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