What do Christians & Atheist think of these quotes?

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isha

Member
"Jacob said, 'I have seen God face to face, and my life is preserved.'" (Genesis 32:30) "No man hath seen God at any time." (John 1:18) We should fear God (Matthew 10:28) We should love God (Matthew 22:37) There is no fear in love (1 John 4:18)
 
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macattakk2000

New member
Jacob wrestled with Jesus...He is the mediator between man and God...the trinity is throughout the bible..Christ emptied himself of the glory he had with God...he thought it not robbery to be equal to God...God is righteous ....man is not....god punishes sin..at the cross chirst became sin and took the punishment for sin for all man...who soeever believes in this gospel shall be saved...jesus rose from the grave conquered the effect of sin paid the penalty for it...we should fear God reverence is the same word, but to realize we deserve judgment does present a sense of fear.yet Gods mercy and redemption is his first choice...he offers it to all men...how can we not love the God who by right could have banished us forever but instead made a door into heave and clothes us in his righteousness through faith in his son to redeem us to the father...it is awesome..creation of angels and man had a purpose..choose the lord or not...for those who choose him they are received for those who dont they get what they deserve...
 
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VeiestStrataNonRete

New member
Agnostic here.
And I'm pretty sure that there are no contradictions here. As a former Christian, I've actually read these passages. Jacob was saying that he had figuratively survived a divine encounter. John's gospel is saying that a man cannot understand God. Matthew's gospel is saying that we should fear and respect God. The other chapter says that we should love him. (ever heard of a leader being both feared and loved?)
John's letter is saying that fear and love are separate, which is what I just said.

I have better reasons to doubt the existance of deity than confusing (for some) bible passages.
 
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Tash

Member
I think that religion is founded around a few things.

1.) Fear. Fear of going to hell, fear of the consequences of not obeying our creed or religion.

2.) Hope: In times of need, people need something to turn to. It comforts them to feel like something superior or supreme is watching over them. In some cases, people completely disregard their own effort in getting through hard times and say, "God helped me through it".. I believe it was their belief that they had someone to fall-back on when they crashed that helped them through it. Not 'God' himself.

3.) Desperation for Meaning: Bad things happen in life, to good people. Terrible things happen. Children get cancer, elderly get dementia, teens get in car crashes that leave them vegetables. People believe that these things happen, because God was working a purpose out of them. A miscarriage might force a mother to come to terms with other issues in her life, making her a stronger woman... people need justification for their suffering, and if they believe 'all bad things happen for a reason', it helps them get-by.

The bible is full of so many loop-holes, contradictions and fabrication.

People spend their lives, devoted to a god- when they could be devoting themselves to finding their soul.

Instead of going to church on sundays, why not meditate... ponder the universe... go outside and smell the roses.

I dont like fundamentalist religion. I dont believe in reading a bible.

I am not saying that there is no higher being- I am just saying that, I refuse to devote my time to something that I have no proof on.

Its like santa claus. Makes you happy when you believe in him, so when the kids at school say hes not real- but mummy and daddy say he is... you choose to believe, because he enriches your life.

The catholic church is so beyond corrupt, I dont know where to begin. Their chapels are worth millions of dollars that could have gone towards a GOOD cause.

Its rubbish.

Live to make the world and yourself a better place- dont live through or for someone else. Even God.
 
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kel

Member
That's why the bible is so damn great.. It says the things you want to hear when you want to hear them.
Any idiot can read the bible and find something he/she likes alongside things he/she hates. That is why the book is still a bestseller even today. It never fails to mess up peoples' minds.
 
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guraqt2me

Member
They mean exactly what they state. Actually, no human has ever seen God (the Father) face to face. Jesus was God in human form and obviously, thousands have seen Him during His 3 1/2 year ministry on earth. Jacob was referring to an angelic being since God the Father never came to the earth. God used Angels [messengers] to speak His will. God is composed of spirit and cannot be seen with human eyes. The term "fear" means a healthy respect - not in trepidation. "Perfect[ed] love, casts out all fear". You need to understand background before jumping to conclusions, as you have obviously done here.
 
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forkboy

New member
lol, the guys who made the bible didn't hav editors by the looks of it. loving and fearing something sounds a bit opressive to me, like "love me and think i exsist or i make u suffer for eternity!"
 
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morporc

New member
Speaking as an Atheist: I wouldn't expect an infinite Being (such as God) to be able to express Himself fully in any human language without at least a handful of apparent inconsistencies.

Think of the double slit experiment: if physics itself is anomalous, God must be moreso.

Any Scripture which is entirely without apparent self-contradiction either:

#1: is incomplete (the ineffable part of God has been avoided); or

#2: is not about a transcendent Being at all.

....

You believe that all of your god can be put in a Book.

This is because your god is small enough.
 
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Bandit

Member
The problem with taking the Bible as fact, is that versions were written and re-written over time. Often with political influence and goals.

A good example is the fact that Mary Magdalene was first portrayed as a prostitue in the version authored by Pope Gregory in 800. His reasoning was to show that even prostitutes could find redemption.

That's fine, but versions have been written to have people "serve their masters" yet "rebel against authority". One must take the literal writings and study them very carefully before committing to them.
 
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PaulB

Member
Well, they're not really "quotes"; they're extracts from a fictional book.

Apparently a poorly edited fictional book, judging by the blatant contradictions.
 
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BePe

New member
I guess I would ask, what do you think all of these passages (which span 1400 years of humanity's experience with God) mean to you?

If you're taking them out of context to prove the Bible contradicts itself then: FAIL (and take a theology class).
 
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