Zimmerman Martin Case

As far as I can see the D.A's office was not going to press charges as there was not sufficient evidence to prosecute, it wasn't until Obama made the comment 'If I had a son, he would have looked like Martin' that the wheels started rolling (they had to do SOMETHING after the presidents 'veiled' comment)

I really don't think there would have been such a media storm if Obama had not waded in to comment on this (after all he doesn't comment on many other of the 'injustices' in the world.)

I still believe that Zimmerman was at fault in this case (my personal opinion) but its a sad state of affairs that this whole thing has turned into an undignified circus that has gone so far that the family involved as 'trademarked' the name of the person killed.

This was a sad and unsettling tragedy, but there are far (far) more worse tragedies that go on in the world that don't get a fraction of this attention.
 
Sky news is playing the President's quote along with a story about how its sparked riots somewhere where a black man was shot while being restrained by transport police. Plus a quote from someone sayinf how blacks only have 3/5ths of the justice system and how Martin did nothing to deserve being shot by a racist vigilante.

My overall impression of this situation so far, this thread included, is the only people seeing racism here are those searching for it and who got no further than "young black man shot." No one claiming racism in this seems to be aware of the actual facts of the case.
 
Despite my own views on who was at fault, I really think it was completely irresponsible for Obama to wade in on this (particularly before ANYONE was found at fault).

He is not like you or me where our comments are restricted to a small proportion of society, his comments would have been reported heavily and had far more weight than the average person (simply because of his status as president.)

I'm pretty gobsmacked he decided to make those comments as almost ALL governmental offices have a blanket policy of 'not commenting on individual cases'.

There is a reason for that, and its quite obvious by breaking that policy Obama has done far more harm than good.
 
Because race is a phenotypic trait.

Sidenote: Anyone confirm or deny that Zimmerman worked as a bouncer and got fired for overly aggressive behavior (supposedly throwing a woman)?

Source: http://www.dailykos.com/story/2012/03/31/1079454/-Zimmerman-was-Fired-from-Security-Job-after-he-Snapped#
 
In the USA, this could mean anything and everything. Even if he got fired, it could mean anything from him throwing a women kata guruma style through the door, to just perpwalking the woman to the door.
 
Oddly enough I have a University Professor of Sociology near my office that was going on about how Obama was a white. I asked what she meant and was told well physically he is 1/2 black but culturally he is not black at all being brought up in a white household and also living in ? Indonesia (or where ever it was). So 3/4 white as a combination of upbringing and blood lines, 1/4 black in terms of blood lines. The prof said that it's hard to see how he could really be representative of a black man's point of view.

Seems like a reasonable argument (oddly how hearing this made me think of the Steve Martin video where he was a poor black share croppers son :' S).

LFD
 
Yeah, I bet living outside the US till he was 10 and having a white mother, like, totally excused him from blackness in the eyes of everyone around him.
 
This, this, and more of this. Even after trial demonstrated that many of the "facts" peddled by the media were either gross mischaracterizations or completely inaccurate, Obama continued to make speeches about how he sees himself in Trayvon Martin, how whites don't understand the black experience in America, etc...and continued with this rhetoric even as "protests" in several major cities crossed the line to rioting and innocent people started to get hurt.
 
Maybe if Obama was as worried about those dead in Benghazi as much as Martin then the country might like him a little better.
 
This... it's not that a "black man got shot by a "white" lol man" it's the fact that a YOUNG KID had to be shot... not a young BLACK kid. A kid is a kid. He was 17, probably had the typical bad attitude like many of us do/did at that age and that might not have helped him in this case, but the race thing needs to be taken down several pegs.
 
I think you have taken the meaning a bit backwards... I think what was being said was that Obama was raised in a predominantly white family and raised outside of any contact with African Americans.... in fact he made efforts in high school to meet African American college students just to try and see how they lived and thought....

There is a quote sometimes attributed to St. Francis Xavierthat goes “Give me the child until he is seven and I’ll give you the man” It suggests that if you bring someone up in a culture/religion to this sort of age the influences will affect them throughout their life.
Ths, if Obama was brought up white then it will have a great impact on his thinking/feelings/actions irrespective of his skin tone.

I never thought that people might mistake him for white!

The person I was quoting said that saying Obama wasn't white would get you labelled a racist... I was just saying that there is evidence that supports the eyes can sometimes be wrong....



LFD
 
Honestly, people think they know Obama and what his background ethnicity is, but most of us really don't and it has been sort of kept secret. I don't personally care what color the man is or where he comes from, I don't like him because I think he's done a crap job during his time as President. It was a political move to campaign him as a President because of 1. his "blackness", 2. He is a well spoken man 3. A fresh, young face rather than the old guys that have been working in politics.

The problem is that Obama's experience level was to low for the office. McCain is a man that IMO would have been an EXCELLENT President. I believe he is a very good man and NO ONE that I know would spend more time in a Vietnam prison camp to wait until he could walk out with his men. That takes guts I don't have I know that.

Either way though, color is of no issue to me when it comes to who I have voted for or who I would vote for.
 
To give an update there has been an arrest in this case. A black male was arrested, he was recently released from prison out on parole. The house had been completely demolished on the inside as he was stripping out the copper wire and plumbing to sell for scrap. Evidently he beat the mom and daughter to death. He tried multiple times to burn down the residence failing only because the plumbing he had destroyed was spewing water in the house.

I'm finding it very difficult to sympathize with the black community when they blame white people for treating them in certain way's. It would do far more for their cause to identify that there is an overwhelming case to justify the fears and prejudices shown towards them.

It's no secret the many struggles that black males in particular have in their lives, however black leaders, Obama included, need to have a conversation about changing Black American, if an overwhelming number of young black people continue to act in a criminal manner then why would there be expected a change in societies view of the black community as a whole.

If dressing and talking in a certain way is a cultural identity for young black people so be it. I think more should be done in the community to identify positive aspects of black culture, because most people associate that type of thing with gang members and thugs. Movies and rap music that glamorize the "gangsta" stereotype and black children then wish to emulate the examples set by these media.

I think a more constructive approach would serve everyone better than a divisive "racist" conversation permeating from the press and Black activists. We as a nation, as a community of people, not black people, or white people, all of us need to work together and lift each other up and set a path to educate and heal society.

This has become a bit personal for me as it hit pretty close to home. I don't consider myself a racist by definition, however I am aware that my actions, attitude, and reactions could be racially motivated. The other side of the coin is that I feel I'm justified to be cautious of black people...until otherwise convinced.

As a side note: I have many black friends and associates and I hate the fact that even though I know them to be good people and enjoy their friendship, that at certain times I'm not comfortable around other black people in certain settings.
 
Except President Obama didn't weigh in on the trial at all. He didn't call anyone guilty, he didn't call anyone innocent, and he didn't claim to know what actually happened. All he was trying to do was explain to white America why black America is so pissed off.
 
Obewan, I really, really disagree with you. The exact same sorts of crimes as the ones you describe happen in rural Oregon. But the perpetrators are generally white people (most often with meth problems). Socioeconomic factors and drug abuse (particularly crack in the black community and meth in the white community) factor into those sorts of crimes. Not skin color and not hip-hop music. In the area around you, that slice of society is predominantly black, so you feel that those sorts of crimes are "black" crimes, but around here that demographic group is predominantly white and they do exactly the same stuff.

Also remember that the most infamous home-invasion-and-theft-turned-murder in recent years, the Cheshire, Connecticut murders, was committed by these two. They planned to rob the house and leave with the family bound but unharmed. But they ended up sexually assaulting an eleven-year-old girl, killing her, her sister, and her mother (one strangled; two were left tied to their beds in a burning house), and leaving the husband savagely beaten but alive:





http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cheshire,_Connecticut,_home_invasion_murders
 
You have just referred to all black people as if they were part of some hive mind. There is not one single "black community" that all thinks a certain way. Speaking as if there is is racism. And before you say it isn't, how many times have you ever used the phrase "the white community" or referred to the entire white population of the country as "them"?

No there isn't. Crime goes where poverty goes. In many of the urban areas of this country, the impoverished are predominantly black, but in the areas where the impoverished aren't black, the crime is still coming from areas of poverty, not areas with lots of black people. Suggesting that racial fear and prejudice is justified is disgusting.

Now you are suggesting that racism is black people's fault, and that it's up to black people to fix it. You are blaming the victim, and you are wrong.

What is "black culture", and what makes you think white people aren't listening to the same rap and watching the same movies? Hint: they are.

Racism is a real problem, and it is therefore reasonable that people should talk about it. Suggesting that talking about racism is "divisive" smells strongly of fear of the subject.

This is first sensible thing in this post; sadly, it is at odds with everything written before it.

You admit to being afraid of black people and are an apologist for racial prejudice. I don't know what your definition of racist is, but I think you might want to revise it.

Again, what you are suggesting here is that your racism is someone else's fault. It is not anyone else's job to fix your prejudices; it is yours.

So you have black friends, but black people scare you? I'm not sure I understand.

If I'm coming off a little hostile here, I apologize. I find your post to be very, very racist, and it is difficult to respond to that politely.
 
Considering what just happened in Obewan's personal life, let's not go at him with both barrels folks.

Obewan, I'm sorry to hear of the tragedy in your family and will be sending thoughts and prayers your way.
 
Agreed, back off a bit guys.



Obewan I'm so sorry to hear of this, my thoughts are with you and your family.
 
I can't paste the article from my phone but I read something Bill Cosby (I think that's his name?) wrote years ago that basically said the same thing as Obewan. He said young black people (Yes Owlmatt I'm going to speak generally. Adding qualifiers every libe is a pain for the sake of being pc) complained about racism and how they were spoor and had relatively less oportunities in life but then at the same time embraced the gangsta segment of black culture. His way of looking at it was if you want to sag your pants, talk street, and follow that kind of sub culture then your to blame when your job interviewd and college applications get rejected.

Obviously that's a very sweeping statement but its an interesting one.
 
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