You raise some good points and highlight some not so well known ones.
P.S Im not Churchil;l's biggest fan
However I dont know how many times iv written it, and I think Mikey has seen I am not diminishing America's role, I already stated they were the tipping point.
Just dont go making out like you were the guys who were there for us all along. Because you were not.
And come on this is getting a bit silly, we are not those men , I wasn;t at Juno beach and neither were any of you.
This is just about having an awareness of history, and just the ignorance floated by populism.
"You'd be speaking German if it wasn;t for us" being the most notable and most laughable considering the facts of the time.
Not one German soldier was on British soil. Something I find people not accepting very well is that Hitler did not want to war with Britain you just have to look at the exchanges between foreign ministries , what he wrote in Mein Kempf, and in his other letters.
Also the offer in 1940.
Now im not saying Hitler was a stand up guy whoes word we can trust, because of course that lacks merit but, based on past actions and words, its hard to see Hitler not accepting a peace deal if we sued for one.
Im going to repost this because I think it got buried quite a bit.
You cannot seriously consider the following points and still come out with, you would be speaking German if it wasn't for us.
"Something I often wonder is,where are all the Germans going to come from to continue battling Britian and more importantly the Soviet Union? People ask where would the Russians get this and where would the British get that but given the nature of the war in Russia where were the Germans themselves gonna come from?
We (Britain) were more likely to produce the atomic bomb than Germany was, as it was the Germans were heading towards a dead end with their notions on it. And without an atomic bomb to put on the end of it a V2 rocket is about the most complicated and expensive way imaginable to send a ton of TNT to a target.
I think we would've gotten a handle on the U-boat war; we had a huge fleet, very capable technical people and Ultra. Then they could have gone back to the proper British strategy of blockade and sea control whilst allied to a strong land power; a strategy that worked well for them in the 18th and 19th Centuries.
German policies in Russia guaranteed that the Russians were gonna fight to the bitter end---the extinction of fascist Germany, to the Russians it was win or die. Every mile deeper in Russia cost the Germans dead and made their logistics harder. The Russians would have eventually started to grow stronger and more consolidated as the Germans grew weaker and more spread out. Without American transport the Russian task would've been more difficult, no doubt. But not impossible. Faced with win or die the Russians would choose to win.
In 1810 Napolean sat astride the World, in 1814 he sat in Elba.
As for the Japanese, well they couldn't do what they wanted to do without fighting The United States, the Germans could have. Once Japan goes after Indonesia and Malaya they have to fight The United States or tolerate the American held Phillipines as a threat on their communications. Which they wouldn't do, obviously.
One must remember that Hitler was not that interested in subjugating and occupying the UK. He really wanted us to simply step aside and stay out of the way, as was made clear in 1940.
On another historical note, its worth mentioning the American ambassador to the UK at the time, was a big time Reich sympathizer.
I seek to no way diminish the sacrifice of any nations soldiers, sailors and airmen, just looking at it from a what if point of view."
As a genuine question, do you-those who think we are brushing off America's role- see it the same way perhaps the French see you brushing away their role in your independence?
I find Frances role in your independence is so often brushed to the side, and replaced with white flag jokes.
Raz